Curse

bilateralrope · Feb 07, 2007, 10:17 AM // 10:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Ages

I Dont see why not just scrap the whole Trader deal all together and go with an Auction House System.

I'm guessing that an auction house would eat up a lot of CPU and bandwidth, which ANET only has a limited amount of. The NPC traders, if they are implemented with even a semi efficient algorithm are likely to require a lot less. But these two systems can work alongside each other, though if we have both it will be in ANET interest to encourage people to use the traders where they exist.

And the code for the traders already exists, while an auction house will need to be programed, probably from scratch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crom The Pale

Even an inscription/upgrade trader would unbalance the game

How exactly would an inscription/upgrade trader unbalance the game ?

Yes it will take a trader a while to start working because it has to build up its stock before prices reach their actual value. But I think that there will be enough people who either don't know or don't care what its really worth to get the trader up and running. I'll be one of those people that doesn't care.

Yes it will likely lower the prices of the more expensive mods, but this is only because that its making them easier to sell and therefore raising the supply. So the people that can stand spamming to sell the mods lose out, those that can't stand it and the buyers win here. Though if you want to you can still sell them at a price between the traders buy and sell prices.

But with a weapon upgrade/inscription trader people will be able to get themselves a set of perfect weaponry without having to deal with the WT S/WT B spam unless they want a rare skin.

The only real problem I can see with this is that the trader will be cluttered, even if it only includes the max quality items. The only solution I can think of to this is to have multiple traders each dealing with a different category of upgrades/inscriptions.

/signed for weapon upgrade/inscription trader
/notsigned for weapon trader, as I still don't understand how it can work with the current traders code. Weapon skins need an auction house.

MithranArkanere · Feb 07, 2007, 10:48 AM // 10:48

Every single 'fixed' sable and equipable item should have a trader.

Weapons are not the case, since they are 'variable'.
But a 'Superior Vigor rune' is ALWAYS a 'Superior Vigor rune'.

Yup, here's the problem: Weapon upgrades are not fixed like runes. The solution is really easy. Weapon upgrades would be set to fixed values after selling them:
You sell a +19% damage gold "Don't Fear The Reaper" inscription, and it would appear as +20% damage in the NPC shop.

The values would be the ones you see in the Balthazar unlocks: Blue, Purple and Gold ones: [10, 15 and 20%], [14, 17, 20], [11, 16, 20], etc...

Mechz · Feb 07, 2007, 11:45 AM // 11:45

I once thought about an upgrade trader; but I actually LIKE having imperfect weapons and upgrading them as I find the pieces. If we introduce a trader, then that would take away the sense of accomplishment, and simply add more to the bloody gold farming requirements. On the other hand, some people farm gold just to buy the upgrades from other players.

Oh well, changing the current system any more will only hurt the trading community.

bilateralrope · Feb 07, 2007, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Yup, here's the problem: Weapon upgrades are not fixed like runes. The solution is really easy. Weapon upgrades would be set to fixed values after selling them:
You sell a +19% damage gold "Don't Fear The Reaper" inscription, and it would appear as +20% damage in the NPC shop.

Actually there are two ways to deal with that:

1 - Have a slot for each level of weapon upgrade. This would cause lots of clutter, especially since most of them would hit the minimum price very quickly.

2 - Only include the maximum stat upgrades at the trader. Assuming that all upgrades and inscriptions are on the same trader, this will still have a very cluttered list.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mechz

I once thought about an upgrade trader; but I actually LIKE having imperfect weapons and upgrading them as I find the pieces. If we introduce a trader, then that would take away the sense of accomplishment, and simply add more to the bloody gold farming requirements. On the other hand, some people farm gold just to buy the upgrades from other players.

If you want to you can still chose to upgrade weapons as you find the parts. Though I would think that for those people with perfect weapons with the mods of their choosing, that very few of them actually found the mods they wanted in their own drops.

Quote:

Oh well, changing the current system any more will only hurt the trading community.

How could a system that allows more people to trade them without having to either endure the trade spam or use a 3rd party solution hurt the trading community ?
Unless by "trading community" you mean those people who don't mind the current system, to the exclusion of everyone else. So please define exactly who you mean by the "trading community".

Also I'd like you to go watch the auctions for the cheaper mods (especially the elemental upgrades). Not how many of them are for below the price listed on the Weapon mod and baseline pricing thread. Then note how many of them still don't sell. Then think about how much work must go into trying to keep that list as close to accurate as it currently is. Then tell me how you would go about assessing the price of the upgrades without people volunteering their time in order to produce that price list.

The Herbalizer · Feb 08, 2007, 02:08 PM // 14:08

anet wont ever do so no point.

how would anet be able to place a value on an item in an economy where the price varies.

would this trader make them in gold, purple or white?

would destroy current economy.

value of weapons changes as once chaos axes sold for 1 million gold now like 50k. would anet vary price according to how desirable they are? as when new chapters out weapons become less popular?

anet creating trader, placing value on every item or item combination, altering prices according to desirability all costs alot of $$$. in a game with no months fee I cannot see this happening.

some items i.e. crystalline, dwarven, serpent are worth more than 100k, 100k cap means they either cannot be sold or will be sold for under 100k. what you think of that? sucks for the hundreds if not thousands of people who have own them. sucks even more for the people spending hundreds, in some cases 1000+ ecto on them. many many people would quit gw over this, anet would not want that.

games where you can make EVERY item cheaply at trader would hardly be desirable as just removes end game content.

anet will never ever do this so pretty pointless thread.

/not signed

bilateralrope · Feb 08, 2007, 07:00 PM // 19:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

how would anet be able to place a value on an item in an economy where the price varies.

The point of a trader is that it automatically changes its prices to reflect the market value.

Quote:

would destroy current economy.

How ?

The rest of your argument is good for arguing against a weapon trader which won't work anyway, as the weapons have randomly generated stats, but doesn't say anything about a trader for weapon upgrades and inscriptions.

The Herbalizer · Feb 08, 2007, 07:14 PM // 19:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by bilateralrope

The point of a trader is that it automatically changes its prices to reflect the market value.

How ?

The rest of your argument is good for arguing against a weapon trader which won't work anyway, as the weapons have randomly generated stats, but doesn't say anything about a trader for weapon upgrades and inscriptions.

O soz for not being more clear. well I dont have a problem with upgrades or inscriptions trader more the weapon idea.

If anet made the trader give out say gold weapons of every skin and they looked same as pre weapon trader items all pre trader items worth over 100k would be affected. As the max gold cap is 100k I would assume the most expensive items would be worth 100k. Unless anet changed cap but they have yet to do that after months/years of compaining about lack of storage.

r8 15>50 crystalline worth 100k+1750 ecto (or used to be) with trader 100k unless cap increased. kinda sucks to those who own one.

i can think of hundreds of items which would lose alot of their value due to this.

thousands if not tens of thousands of players own 100k+ items and suddenly for them to lose their value would suck majorly. without a doubt alot would quit in disgust.

all the stuff in the high end forum would be affected as the item prices would have to fall.

i wouldnt particularly care if the items were blue or white and clearly came from trader as wouldnt affect gold as much.
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i think the idea is too complicated for a free game and is kinda too late to implement considering alot of items are very cheap now.

would be nice to leave the people who want nice items something to work for as sub 100k items arnt hard to afford. nice collections would be based on who has the most items.